Navigating Transformation at Siemens: Leadership, AI, and the Human Element

Narrator: When your company is undergoing a transformation, it requires transformational leadership to carry it through successfully. And part of that is managing uncertainty among employees. That’s one of the things we hear from Alexander Senn. 

Alex Senn: We’re in the midst of a transformation journey to become one tech company. And we want to work with the people together to create really the best for the future. And that’s why we decided to communicate quite early what is our ambition. But we don’t have all the answers. And now we’re working with the people close to the topics. We take them on board, we listen, and they can also co create with us together the new Siemens. 

Narrator: Alex is Head of People and Organization at Siemens Smart Infrastructure. He’s a seasoned human resources leader with over 16 years of experience across major global organizations. He’s been in his current role since April, 2019, and previously held leadership positions in HR at Siemens building technologies and Swisscom where he focused on HR operations, digital transformation, and recruitment. And in this episode, Alex and host Nicole Alvino discuss employee segmentation for improved experience, the role of leadership and transformation journeys, and the use of AI for productivity and innovation. On Cruising Altitude. We talk about employee experience lessons from leaders at companies with over 30, 000 employees, a lot like reaching cruising altitude at 30, 000 feet. Things look a little different when you’re managing 30, 000 people on this podcast, we bring you insights from the leaders who inhabit that rarefied air. Today’s episode features an interview with Alex Senn, but first let’s hear a word from our sponsor. And now your host, Nicole Alvino, CEO and co-founder of Firstup.

Nicole Alvino: Hello, everyone, and thanks for joining us on Cruising Altitude. I’m Nicole Alvino, founder and CEO of Firstup. Super passionate about ensuring that every worker feels connected and engaged with their employer. Firstup is a SaaS platform used by 40 of the Fortune 100 to provide an exceptional employee experience for every employee. When we do this, we retain and grow our people and increase efficiency and adoption of organizational initiatives, all part of driving a high performance culture. So our mission today is to help you learn about how we can retain top talent, improve organizational culture, and drive your business outcomes. So, it’s so exciting to be joined by Alex Senn today. Alex, we always introduce new employees at Firstup with three fun facts. And I like to start my podcast that way as well. So can you please share your three fun facts?

Alex Senn: Yeah, one fact is that when I was a child, I had a um, a budgie as an animal, right? It was my favorite animal and called Gypsy. And I trained Gypsy to talk and I trained him to say his name, but also the address because my thought was when he flies away, then whenever he, someone sees him, then he knows where to bring the budgie back. So that’s his Gypsy. always close to my heart. And the other one is I was in a scouts group and my name there was Cheesy. Not because I stink like a cheese, but back then I hated cheese. Even smelling, to smell cheese was horrible for me, so that’s why they called me Cheesy. And the last one is I played in a carnivals group trumpet. Nice time, but I don’t do it anymore.

Nicole Alvino: Okay, good. Well,

Alex Senn: I don’t know if this is fun enough, but, 

Nicole Alvino: They are. They are. They’re great. They’re great fun. Well, we’ll stick with Alex over cheesy and we will not ask you to play the trumpet. How’s that?

Alex Senn: That’s perfect.

Nicole Alvino: Okay. Well, good. Well, tell us a little bit about your role and the part of Siemens where you work.

Alex Senn: So my role within Siemens is I’m globally responsible for people in the organization for Siemens smart infrastructure and other composites called HR. And is one role I have. And the other one is I’m a, in the leadership team globally of people and organization and in that role, I have to make sure whatever we do on a corporate level lands within the business and and create impact to create even greater business results.

Nicole Alvino: absolutely. And yes, as we both know, nothing happens in business without people and people being on board. So we’ll, we’ll talk more about that, but can you share what this smart infrastructure group does? It could mean a lot, especially now with AI, the forefront of, of everything we’re doing.

Alex Senn: So, exactly. So, in Siemens, we combine the real and the digital and the business I’m in is around energy systems, but also industrial solutions for, for energy and also the whole topic of building technologies. So implementing building solutions, enhanced comfort, safety, and efficiency, but especially also to make really energy transition much efficient and also sustainable energy use and also make energy much more safer. So this is all about you’re in. And as you can imagine, when you’re talking sustainability, so to make the world a much safer and much more sustainable place to live, then we are spot on with our products. And that’s why we are also riding a wave at the moment when we look into our business results, because our products and solutions. And services that we ask from our customers.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, absolutely. And within the business, can you tell us about the different types of employee personas that you need to manage?

Alex Senn: Yeah, I mean, we’re talking here a big company, so we’re talking 70, 000 people worldwide in, in over 150 countries. So that’s why there are many, many people, personas, and, we have different types of, people we are looking for in R& D, manufacturing, sales all the support functions project managers, et cetera. So that’s why it’s quite a diverse group, and that’s why we all decided back then to really segment our people So we’re talking people segmentation because that is not the persona we’re looking for. There are different personas and you need to understand them. And we’ll talk about people experience later. And that’s why it’s even more important to really understand the persona and what, drives them, where do we need to create the great people experience? So that’s why it’s so important to look in a segmented way to a workforce.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it’s, we know that getting that first that employee or people mapping and persona alignment, and then understanding because someone who’s working in one of your R and D facilities needs something different from someone in a support center or someone who’s, Who’s selling and so really understanding and how to do that. So can you share a little bit more about how you do that segmentation and then how that translates into the employee experience that you’re, giving each of these segments.

Alex Senn: I mean, what you’re really driving is people experience also from a technology standpoint that really want to implement technologies that really lands well with our people working for Siemens. And that’s why you really need to, as you said, right, you need to understand the different types of personas you want to address, but you can’t create from A to Z always top experience that would be very costly. And so that’s why we need to decide what are the we call it the moment that matters. So you need to understand what are the moments that matters the most. And here you need to keep an eye on it. You need to work on really the best experience. Because you can’t have the best experience from A to Z as I said. So you need to, to pick and choose where are the moments we need to work on on the best experience ever, whatever it is right at the end of the day, it’s technologies, but not only technologies. I’m also saying experience also comes with interacting with each other, peer to peer, and especially with the leaders. So that’s why also have a special eye on our leaders that they create the experience there that people want. Because if you really create them, that environment of, I call it psychology safety, then people can outperform.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, definitely. I think two important points. One, just the importance of that leader and first line manager to provide the experience and also the moments that matter. And I think they’re, you know, what if there, we could create a world where, and all of those moments that matter to the individual, we could give them this hyper personalized type of experience. I think that’s something that I know we’re, we’re working towards and enabling using a technology to enable that. But let’s take the moments that matter and let’s talk about moments that matter to the organization and to the people. And these are moments of change and transformation. Can you talk a little bit about what’s happening now at, Siemens and how you’re managing.

Alex Senn: So we’re in the midst of a transformational journey, transformation journey to become one tech company And we did it a little bit differently than in the past. In the past, maybe we would have created a small group that worked on the future Siemens, and there was the Big Bang, the communication, the senior organization, et cetera. And we do it differently this time because we want to take as many people as possible with us, and we want to work with the people together to create really the best Siemens for the future. And that’s why we decided to communicate quite early what is our ambition. But we don’t have all the answers. And now we’re working with the people close to the topics. We take them on board, we listen, and they can also co create with us together the new Siemens. And this is different. This is also a new way of, I would say, empowering, taking people on board early. But it also creates at the same time a little bit of uncertainty, because people know something is happening. But they don’t know the result and now we’re talking not only a couple of months, we’re talking many, many, many months when they really don’t, when they know what’s going to happen. But I believe people need to learn to live with uncertainty and it’s much better to be transparent with the people and to invite them to contribute. The same time, also, they need to learn to live with the fact that we don’t have all the answers. But I’m a strong believer that the outcome is much better when we involve more people, when we listen to the concerns and then we maybe on the journey you adapt and some of the ideas you had at the beginning after listening to, to more than the only, only the top management.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, absolutely. So how are you doing that? Any tactics or any things that you can share?

Alex Senn: Yeah. I mean, I, I can’t go into detail, but what we want to, to start with, with smaller groups, right? Because you can’t discuss such a big transformation in, in a bigger round, right? So you need to bring the, the people who are close to the topic together and, and then discuss it and then. Maybe there are different routes and with other people where you can share and there are some, let’s say, let’s call it counseling, but some listening groups, or they give feedback, their views, et cetera. And then some of the feedback incorporating the solution, some not, and this is the way we’re really driving that transformation and. And also maybe key is to, we should not forget to why we’re doing this to explain. So you need to communicate and explain why we’re changing and we don’t change everything. So don’t touch what’s working, but then fix the issues we have now. What is then really the, what’s better than with a new setup we maybe have in the future within Siemens. So this is maybe something I would definitely recommend doing when you’re on a transformation journey, and

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, no, I think that’s right. Just listening to, to other people who have different perspectives, that is always key to any change. And then we find too, that just the. making sure that the messages when they do go out are understood by the individuals and what that means for them, especially with so many different people, personas out doing their job and making sure that they understand the purpose and what they’re doing and how that ladders up to the change.

Alex Senn: maybe when I just kind of listening, what you just now now said is communicating is really important, but also then keep your ears and eyes open also give the room or create the platforms where people can then give feedback what they have read, what they’ve heard, raising concerns because yes, we need people are positive and looking into the change and helping etcetera. But we also need to listen to people who are really concerned. And then really reconsider is there something in there we, we need to take with us and maybe change or adapt or maybe not. And, or then we know, oh, what we maybe knew we need to communicate even more often. And let me make a comment on, on change. I mean, sometimes in a transformation, not everything changes, right? There are jobs that will be the same. Doesn’t matter what is the new Siemens look like in a couple of years. So. This is also important. We should not now distract people from working and performing. So we need to be very careful. What is really then changing and addressing these groups and maybe leave the others a little bit. Give them security. Hey, there was not, there will not be that much change for you. Keep going. You do a wonderful job. You are successful. So this is maybe also very, very important and that makes it even, even harder for a big, big company like Siemens or a small infrastructure. I said, right, 70, 000 people, different businesses, different regions, etc. So the, the magnitude of change is different from business to business and that’s why it’s also important to to address it very clearly to the specific personas, as you said. Right.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, that’s exactly right. The type of change is different by personas, the perception of the change. And to your point that the communication, it has to be two way. You can say something, but it’s how it’s received on the other side by your people. Do they understand what that means? Are they nervous? How do you give them more support and really understanding that piece, I think, as you said, is really key to bringing people along and making sure that you get the performance out of the transformation. So, how are you utilizing AI to help with the transformation?

Alex Senn: I mean, AI can really help us to gain productivity. So first and foremost, right? let’s start with the business. There are use cases in the business that really help us to develop much more innovative products, thanks to AI. There are also business opportunities If you don’t apply AI, and our main competitors, they do, then you’re out of business because maybe they come up with a much cheaper product, for example. They don’t need to do that of investments, thanks to, to AI, et cetera. So this is definitely something there are some business use cases, and maybe in some areas with, without using AI, you would be maybe out of business in the future. The second part is maybe internally is to, to look where are personas. Let’s, use the frame. Personas where we can really apply, or they can use AI to gain productivity. And that helps, right? Because we need to find productivity each and every year and AI is a beautiful technology we can achieve that and last but not least, but it’s also that this is then a little bit the basis that we need to bring everyone on board when it comes to AI. So that’s why this is the advantage being a big, big company, we’re using CoPilot, for example, different other AI tools we give access to, that people can learn. I think you need to work with AI that you really understand AI, how can you make use of it in your daily life. And talking now personally, it’s amazing what I save time every week, thanks to, for example, Microsoft CoPilot. And now it’s on me to role model that within my team, because I always mention it, I show them, et cetera, and I also invest money that I give access to my people because it you have to pay the license, right, to use Microsoft Pilot, but I give it to my team because I also want them to learn how to use AI. I think this is our, our responsibility as Siemens. Is it also something to do with employability from my perspective that you bring everyone on the journey using AI.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, no, a couple of really great points about just investing in your people and making sure that they’re ready for the future and making sure that they have the right skills and that in and of itself is change and transformation, getting the workforce AI ready if you will. And so that’s another transformation that can help the bigger transformation potentially go better and faster. And it requires even more investment in making sure you’re bringing people along and not leaving anyone behind. And how do you take something from your. organizational design role, something like, AI to help with transformation. Is that something that you would set a standard for different leaders or is that up to the leaders to decide how they want to help their, their people get upskilled? Yeah. 

Alex Senn: No, I mean, this is not, not, not specific for a site that the topic is also driven on a corporate level, right? For example Microsoft pilot, but also there are we call it AI by design that we really using AI. In projects and also developing products, et cetera. we also do a mapping of heat map, right? , where we should use, but also challenge maybe the business that there is maybe a missed opportunity. So I would say, let me put it like that. I believe for strong belief our business, they’re very close to the AI topic. And they’re already, they know what they’re doing. They see the opportunities and they’re also applied or start to invest. But the other hand, you also need to maybe from a corporate level to have some experts who really also helping maybe challenge the business. Because sometimes if someone is successful , they bring the results, et cetera, maybe you need to challenge them. Maybe there’s more to achieve when we’re using AI, for example. So, or maybe we have some, some use cases we never thought about and let’s try. So that’s why, but I can’t go that much into it, I think we have to be honest with ourselves, I think many, many companies are, are at the beginning. There’s so much more to come in a speed we have never seen before. So that’s why it will be a topic that, that keeps us busy the next, next coming years.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, absolutely. And just to your point, making sure that everyone has access to the tools they need and more importantly, how to use them. You have a really interesting concept about a rhino view and perspective, which I think applies to this in any change. So can you just share what that is?

Alex Senn: I mean, maybe I can I can share the story. We had an SI management conference. So. We bring them, the top management leaders from a side together, over 100 in a room, and then I showed up as a rhino, dressed as a rhino. Quite funny, by the way. There, after the session, there were some pictures sent around the world, Alex as a rhino. And first, they thought, they laughed, and they they thought it’s a funny guy from Switzerland, but I did it by intention. Because I really wanted them to never forget the speech that followed afterward. Because then I undressed as a rhino. And had an opening speech why the rhino and there was a cartoon or a picture of a cartoon who I showed then there was, you could see then a rhino as a painter and the rhino painted an animal on the sofa, and in the back, you could see at the wall. paintings the rhino did. And on these paintings you saw the horn, because I mean, the rhino sees the horn because the horn is in front the eye. But we, when we look at the painter, we don’t see the horn because we don’t have a horn. So that was a little bit, and then we had uh, someone talking about how our brain works, et cetera. And this is exactly the rhino view, and the rhino is for me a symbol that we should not forget that we all have our view on something. So the rhino view. and the intention was to have a symbol that reminds us we all have our rhino views. And in a meeting, when you’re in a meeting, sometimes I also say, do you have at the moment, this is now your Rhino view or, or maybe I start a sentence of, Hey, this is maybe my Rhino view, but this is my, my view on it, et cetera. But I want to have your perspective. So that should remind us that we should sometimes shift perspective, but ease the situation, I believe, and creates a better understanding of each other. And that creates a much better solution because when we’re listening to each other, bring maybe ideas together and create something new out of it, it’s a much better solution and become much easier to an end and to to close the topic.

Yeah, no, I love that story. I’m curious if there’s anything you can share if you push someone to on the view and having a different perspective and something that you got to a better outcome from that. 

Oh, there are many stories. I mean, in my, my position situation, I’m always involved when something goes wrong or I need to somehow a little bit be the mediator between, I don’t know, two businesses, leaders, et cetera, and then pulled in as a P& O experts fixing relationships, I always remind them don’t come to me, say directly. So this is the first start. I think we all need to learn to address topics directly in a very nice way, but also first starting with why the person has another opinion than I have. What is the rhino view that person has and what is maybe my rhino view? And if you, if you do that reflection, then it creates a different environment of, of talking to each other. So I believe we still, we have a little bit unlearned to listen because everything, speed, pressure, etc. But we should start listening first and trying to understand. And that creates then the basis of a, of a much, much better much better situation. And maybe one piece of advice, and I do that. I give now not a concrete examples but what I do in a very critical situation where maybe two people or a team with a leader, et cetera, they have different rhino views et cetera. I go for a walk, you know why?

Nicole Alvino: Why?

Alex Senn: Because you’re shifting perspective because you’re moving. So whenever you have a a difficult conversation with someone, even in private life at home, et cetera, go for a walk because then you’re moving. It’s much easier because then you’re moving. Then your body moves and then you’re also much more flexible. Don’t do it at home. Stand up, walk. So this is maybe my 

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, 

Alex Senn: little tip.

Nicole Alvino: that. That’s great. That’s great. Perspective and something I need to do that with my teenage son. We need to walk to get him to share things with me. So

Alex Senn: Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I’m, I’m, my, my kids, they are five, eight and ten. So they still love me. I’m still the hero. But I know that time will come, right? They don’t want to ask. They have my opinion and they, maybe they even don’t want to talk to me. So I’m taking with me, I should enjoy now the time. With my little ones,

Nicole Alvino: Absolutely. So let’s circle back on the Rhino view and how we can help provide that incredible employee experience and digital employee experience for everyone. I think what, what is your wish that you could do for the 80, 000 people who you support if they could get something, you know, from, from Siemens in those moments that matter.

Alex Senn: I mean, first and foremost, I mean, it’s technology that it’s easy to use. It’s fast, et cetera. I mean, this is not that difficult. I have to say the problem with that is that still there are different personas and maybe different needs and we can’t, maybe that would be too expensive, right? To create different processes and tools for different personas. Maybe there’s not. So that’s why maybe need to live with. With a technology or an app, whatever that you can use, but it’s maybe not always the best experience. Sometimes I also, it’s a little bit blaming technology is maybe, I know if it really helps. I also deal sometimes with internal tools. Yes, there could be better tools, but is it that bad? No, it’s not that bad. It’s okay. Right. So that’s why a little bit shifting, because what is really important, I believe. Working with a tool is not that important, I think much more important is the collaboration, how we treat each other, the respect. Do we really follow our values, and this is much more important. And here. is maybe what I would wish for is that I mean, we have all these trainees, et cetera, the help, but it starts with self reflection. And I always ask when I’m in interview about leadership skills, et cetera. And when someone says I’m already in a scale from one to 10, 10, then I have big question marks because. You will never be on a 10 as a leader. There will be different situations, different people you need to lead. Maybe you need to lead people differently. And this is maybe key message you need to listen to understand what that person really needs to perform better, to be happier, to be much more engaged, et cetera. Maybe create that personal people experience. And as a leader, you can do. And some of these things you can do, it’s for free, for example, appreciation. It costs nothing. Yes, it costs time, but it’s well spent time, believe me. And I believe sometimes we are so much under pressure than we forget to be in the moment to be with yourself. Sometimes you’re in a meeting, you don’t act as you should act. You don’t treat your people as you should treat your people because you had an experience before the meeting and you take that experience still with you, anger, pressure, etc. So my big wish is whenever we find before you start your next meeting, a moment of self reflection, a little bit cooling down and really prepare and be present. Being present and now this is my time I spent with my team, with my person. That would be a big wish. And if you have an idea how I can do that with. pushing one button, maybe it’s not possible. So that’s why we just need to keep going, train our people. And, maybe there is some things that we have called ESCAS. So we have people surveys or two times a year. So this is the great opportunity to see which of the leaders say they need help, because the results are not that good. They’re going in the wrong direction. So this is something what we can do to measure. And then also to. To show and to address these teams, they’re really not performing or the people that don’t feel safe to speak up or they don’t feel the empowerment, etc. And all these kind of, values give ourselves.

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, well, we might just have that magic button 1 day to automate personalized experiences at scale. So we can talk about that at another time. But I love the point around cog. I call it cognitive closure. At the end of a meeting beginning to for the next one to make sure that you, you finish the thoughts and finish what you need to do before we, we race off to the next one. So I always like to end these podcasts. This has been such a great conversation for people to understand one thing that you never do and one thing that you always do. So our listeners can take some of your wisdom with them. 

Alex Senn: Oh, this is hard. Never. I don’t like the word never. Because I want to stay open, maybe something I don’t do, but I should do in the future. So that’s why I never, I don’t know, maybe let me change it a little bit. What I do not enough is to take care of myself. So what I’m, maybe my tip is I’m not the best role model. Sometimes I’m back to back meetings. So that’s why maybe I definitely could do much more often. And what I always do smile. And I, I make, and maybe my team hates me for that. I, I make many, many jokes a day. Because I believe we need to unease situation. And humor is a beautiful tool we can apply. I think we should have fun at work, even in a crisis, even in a tough situation. Laughing is a wonderful for me definitely it helps stay positive. And uh, yeah, this is maybe what I do always.

Nicole Alvino: it. No, that’s perfect. Smile and laugh. It’s the only way between change and transformation. That is a way to get through and really connecting with that human element, which as we started saying, all companies and all outcomes, business outcomes are driven by people and we need to bring our people along. And if we can. Smile, even when things are tough, perhaps that’s how we can, can get to that best outcome. 

So Alex, thank you so much for joining us.

Alex Senn: Nicole, for inviting me

Nicole Alvino: Really great conversation. And can you share with our listeners how they can find you?

Alex Senn: On LinkedIn, Alexander S E N N. So then ask me, then I will definitely accept the invitation to connect happy to connect and keep the conversation going about transformation, culture, leadership, whatever it is,

Nicole Alvino: Yeah, so many great topics and we can continue that conversation online. Thanks again, Alex.

Alex Senn: Thank you. Bye bye.